Comments on: My First Semester Shock, or Seminarians Without Chests http://seminarysurvivalguide.com/2009/09/21/my-first-semester-shock-or-seminarians-without-chests/ practical wisdom to help seminary students avoid burnout and finish well Sun, 25 Jul 2010 05:08:14 +0000 hourly 1 http://wordpress.org/?v=3.0 By: Dan http://seminarysurvivalguide.com/2009/09/21/my-first-semester-shock-or-seminarians-without-chests/comment-page-1/#comment-599 Dan Wed, 07 Jul 2010 17:44:26 +0000 http://seminarysurvivalguide.com/2007/12/14/my-first-semester-shock-or-seminarians-without-chests/#comment-599 Hi Mark, I, too am a MDiv student at Denver Seminary, and I am relatively new as I am only entering into my second semester. Already I can feel my devotional time slipping away, while the desire to just study God and not talk to Him rears its ugly head. I have a few Seminary friends (both graduates and newbies like me) who cannot help but see The Bible as a textbook. That, or they cannot help but over-analyze Scripture instead of just reading it. Being a relatively new Christian, I still find that reading The Bible for enjoyment is very difficult for me - it almost always feels like work, and it almost always feels a bit...well...dry if I'm honest. I'm not looking to Seminary to fill my devotional time, but I am keenly aware of the dangers of being a student first and a son of God second. Thanks for your words. -Dan Cross Hi Mark,

I, too am a MDiv student at Denver Seminary, and I am relatively new as I am only entering into my second semester. Already I can feel my devotional time slipping away, while the desire to just study God and not talk to Him rears its ugly head.

I have a few Seminary friends (both graduates and newbies like me) who cannot help but see The Bible as a textbook. That, or they cannot help but over-analyze Scripture instead of just reading it.

Being a relatively new Christian, I still find that reading The Bible for enjoyment is very difficult for me – it almost always feels like work, and it almost always feels a bit…well…dry if I’m honest. I’m not looking to Seminary to fill my devotional time, but I am keenly aware of the dangers of being a student first and a son of God second.

Thanks for your words.

-Dan Cross

]]> By: Tom Ryberg http://seminarysurvivalguide.com/2009/09/21/my-first-semester-shock-or-seminarians-without-chests/comment-page-1/#comment-582 Tom Ryberg Mon, 03 May 2010 15:10:05 +0000 http://seminarysurvivalguide.com/2007/12/14/my-first-semester-shock-or-seminarians-without-chests/#comment-582 Thanks for this encouragement. It's an Enlightenment-era fantasy that we can intellectualize ourselves into our faiths. Don't get me wrong: good theology is REALLY IMPORTANT, because bad theology is terribly destructive. But at some point, it is necessary to put down the books and say, "Lord I believe; help my unbelief." <i><blockquote>I agreed with him about the challenges of proper interpretation, but then I asked him, “You mean to tell me that Farmer Jones out in East Texas can’t sit down with his Bible and his morning coffee, pray that God will speak to him through it and expect reliably to hear from God?” He said, “No, that’s not possible.” He went on to say that God could speak just as well through the “funnies” in the newspaper as he could through the Bible.</blockquote></i> Wow indeed. It is true that going to the Bible with good intentions does not always result hearing or understanding the Word of God, and I agree with him that God can certainly Speak to anyone through any medium. But, obviously, any medium would have to include...THE BIBLE. With or without "acceptable" exegesis. Sheesh! Thanks for this encouragement. It’s an Enlightenment-era fantasy that we can intellectualize ourselves into our faiths. Don’t get me wrong: good theology is REALLY IMPORTANT, because bad theology is terribly destructive. But at some point, it is necessary to put down the books and say, “Lord I believe; help my unbelief.”


I agreed with him about the challenges of proper interpretation, but then I asked him, “You mean to tell me that Farmer Jones out in East Texas can’t sit down with his Bible and his morning coffee, pray that God will speak to him through it and expect reliably to hear from God?”

He said, “No, that’s not possible.”

He went on to say that God could speak just as well through the “funnies” in the newspaper as he could through the Bible.

Wow indeed. It is true that going to the Bible with good intentions does not always result hearing or understanding the Word of God, and I agree with him that God can certainly Speak to anyone through any medium. But, obviously, any medium would have to include…THE BIBLE. With or without “acceptable” exegesis. Sheesh!

]]> By: steve http://seminarysurvivalguide.com/2009/09/21/my-first-semester-shock-or-seminarians-without-chests/comment-page-1/#comment-581 steve Mon, 03 May 2010 13:55:06 +0000 http://seminarysurvivalguide.com/2007/12/14/my-first-semester-shock-or-seminarians-without-chests/#comment-581 No, the "Golden Rule #1" does not say "WORSHIP". It says, at least in most interpretations, "LOVE". Not really the same thing. And, please don't deign to tell me that my manner of loving God is not as good as yours, or not what I should be doing. Don't you dare tell me that. I don't care if you're a minister in a church I attend, or some other congregation or denomination. You're confusing Faith with Religion. That is a huge difference, and a huge misinterpretation which causes a lot of turmoil in people's lives. No, the “Golden Rule #1″ does not say “WORSHIP”. It says, at least in most interpretations, “LOVE”. Not really the same thing.

And, please don’t deign to tell me that my manner of loving God is not as good as yours, or not what I should be doing. Don’t you dare tell me that. I don’t care if you’re a minister in a church I attend, or some other congregation or denomination. You’re confusing Faith with Religion. That is a huge difference, and a huge misinterpretation which causes a lot of turmoil in people’s lives.

]]> By: Julie http://seminarysurvivalguide.com/2009/09/21/my-first-semester-shock-or-seminarians-without-chests/comment-page-1/#comment-578 Julie Mon, 03 May 2010 11:35:22 +0000 http://seminarysurvivalguide.com/2007/12/14/my-first-semester-shock-or-seminarians-without-chests/#comment-578 Also an MDiv student, though an older one, and also struggling with this. I find that staying involved in my local church has been important, also I work with a spiritual director, and consider that essential. That said, I have lots of dry spots in my devotions. I'm working full time (that is ending soon) and have difficult time finding time for prayer and meditation. On the plus side, having grown up Catholic, without a daily scripture habit, I am finding that I am reading scripture much more now than I have been. I'm making the daily prayer part of my personal goals, and incorporating it in class where I can. That helps a lot. Also an MDiv student, though an older one, and also struggling with this. I find that staying involved in my local church has been important, also I work with a spiritual director, and consider that essential. That said, I have lots of dry spots in my devotions. I’m working full time (that is ending soon) and have difficult time finding time for prayer and meditation.

On the plus side, having grown up Catholic, without a daily scripture habit, I am finding that I am reading scripture much more now than I have been.

I’m making the daily prayer part of my personal goals, and incorporating it in class where I can. That helps a lot.

]]> By: Mike http://seminarysurvivalguide.com/2009/09/21/my-first-semester-shock-or-seminarians-without-chests/comment-page-1/#comment-557 Mike Thu, 24 Sep 2009 17:11:46 +0000 http://seminarysurvivalguide.com/2007/12/14/my-first-semester-shock-or-seminarians-without-chests/#comment-557 Great article and I agree. I fought this a lot in Bible College and know it can rear its ugly head again. Interestingly, you can actually loose sight of God in the Bible…almost seems like a contradiction, but if you have attended BC of Seminary you understand exactly what I am refereeing to. Great article and I agree. I fought this a lot in Bible College and know it can rear its ugly head again. Interestingly, you can actually loose sight of God in the Bible…almost seems like a contradiction, but if you have attended BC of Seminary you understand exactly what I am refereeing to.

]]> By: Craig Beeman http://seminarysurvivalguide.com/2009/09/21/my-first-semester-shock-or-seminarians-without-chests/comment-page-1/#comment-481 Craig Beeman Tue, 30 Jun 2009 01:55:10 +0000 http://seminarysurvivalguide.com/2007/12/14/my-first-semester-shock-or-seminarians-without-chests/#comment-481 I have found that that is very common. I am also a Southwesterner. I find it hard even today, at times, to maintain a regular devotional time with God. I run here and there, from a member's house to a hospital. I could get up earlier. I really need to. It's all about self-discipline. In fact, I think I'll do a bit of it now. Thanks. I have found that that is very common. I am also a Southwesterner. I find it hard even today, at times, to maintain a regular devotional time with God. I run here and there, from a member’s house to a hospital. I could get up earlier. I really need to. It’s all about self-discipline. In fact, I think I’ll do a bit of it now. Thanks.

]]> By: Mark http://seminarysurvivalguide.com/2009/09/21/my-first-semester-shock-or-seminarians-without-chests/comment-page-1/#comment-33 Mark Wed, 02 Jan 2008 16:05:16 +0000 http://seminarysurvivalguide.com/2007/12/14/my-first-semester-shock-or-seminarians-without-chests/#comment-33 Jason, Welcome, friend. We'll have some good time management ideas up soon for you. I did seminary as a single guy, and I have no idea how the married guys managed it. Your story affirms two of my convictions: (1) Life is found in the local church, (2) life is found in sustaining relationships. Hope SSG is helpful to you. If you have any ideas, I'm always open to suggestions. Jason,

Welcome, friend. We’ll have some good time management ideas up soon for you. I did seminary as a single guy, and I have no idea how the married guys managed it.

Your story affirms two of my convictions: (1) Life is found in the local church, (2) life is found in sustaining relationships.

Hope SSG is helpful to you. If you have any ideas, I’m always open to suggestions.

]]> By: Mark http://seminarysurvivalguide.com/2009/09/21/my-first-semester-shock-or-seminarians-without-chests/comment-page-1/#comment-32 Mark Wed, 02 Jan 2008 16:02:45 +0000 http://seminarysurvivalguide.com/2007/12/14/my-first-semester-shock-or-seminarians-without-chests/#comment-32 Stephen, Great quote from John Frame. I wasn't familiar with him. Thanks for sharing that. As a recent seminary grad, your insights will be very helpful here, so come by any time! Stephen,

Great quote from John Frame. I wasn’t familiar with him. Thanks for sharing that. As a recent seminary grad, your insights will be very helpful here, so come by any time!

]]> By: Jason Lowe http://seminarysurvivalguide.com/2009/09/21/my-first-semester-shock-or-seminarians-without-chests/comment-page-1/#comment-29 Jason Lowe Wed, 02 Jan 2008 04:16:23 +0000 http://seminarysurvivalguide.com/2007/12/14/my-first-semester-shock-or-seminarians-without-chests/#comment-29 Mark, Great word and very true. I'm currently a full-time M.Div student at Southern Seminary, working a full-time secular job, full-time husband, and the Sunday School Director of a local church in Louisville. With all of the demands on my time, it quickly became a struggle to read the Word for the pure spiritual nourishment that I need. This is still a struggle, but I have found that it was better for me to connect with some lay-members of my church who are not seminarians. I have an accountability partner relationship with two of them and this has really helped me to read the Word devotionally. We each read the same Scriptures each week, and then meet weekly to discuss what God has revealed to us. This has really helped me to guard against the struggle of becoming a cold, theological egghead. The insights that these brothers share with me simply blow me away sometimes, and it is truly a humbling experience. I would recommend this type of accountability partner relationship to seminarians and current ministers alike. Thanks for the encouraging site. I ran across it from the Said at Southern metablog and I will be back often. In Christ, Jason Mark,

Great word and very true. I’m currently a full-time M.Div student at Southern Seminary, working a full-time secular job, full-time husband, and the Sunday School Director of a local church in Louisville. With all of the demands on my time, it quickly became a struggle to read the Word for the pure spiritual nourishment that I need. This is still a struggle, but I have found that it was better for me to connect with some lay-members of my church who are not seminarians. I have an accountability partner relationship with two of them and this has really helped me to read the Word devotionally. We each read the same Scriptures each week, and then meet weekly to discuss what God has revealed to us. This has really helped me to guard against the struggle of becoming a cold, theological egghead. The insights that these brothers share with me simply blow me away sometimes, and it is truly a humbling experience. I would recommend this type of accountability partner relationship to seminarians and current ministers alike.

Thanks for the encouraging site. I ran across it from the Said at Southern metablog and I will be back often.

In Christ,
Jason

]]> By: Stephen Jones http://seminarysurvivalguide.com/2009/09/21/my-first-semester-shock-or-seminarians-without-chests/comment-page-1/#comment-28 Stephen Jones Tue, 01 Jan 2008 21:55:22 +0000 http://seminarysurvivalguide.com/2007/12/14/my-first-semester-shock-or-seminarians-without-chests/#comment-28 Mark, I enjoyed reading your post. Seminary days are indeed challenging. Knowledge is a dangerous thing. The more we learn about language, theology, hermeneutics, history, higher and lower criticism, etc., the more we can become both proud and ambivalent toward divine truth. By the grace of God, we must always retain a child-like faith, affection, and confidence in the gospel of Jesus Christ in our studies. John Frame has a helpful little booklet called, "Studying Theology as a Servant of Jesus." In it, he writes, "Remember that your seminary years are not only a preparation for discipleship. They must themselves be a time of discipleship. They are not a hiatus from the Christian life. During these years you will and should have somewhat different priorities from those you will have later on. But even as a seminarian, you have a responsibility to do things other than study. You are a Christian first, a student second." Having just finished seminary a year and a half ago, I can testify it was "the best of times and worst of times," but God used seminary to refine me and build a firm theological foundation that could withstand the storms of life and ministry. Press on, and God bless you brother! Mark, I enjoyed reading your post. Seminary days are indeed challenging. Knowledge is a dangerous thing. The more we learn about language, theology, hermeneutics, history, higher and lower criticism, etc., the more we can become both proud and ambivalent toward divine truth. By the grace of God, we must always retain a child-like faith, affection, and confidence in the gospel of Jesus Christ in our studies.

John Frame has a helpful little booklet called, “Studying Theology as a Servant of Jesus.” In it, he writes, “Remember that your seminary years are not only a preparation for discipleship. They must themselves be a time of discipleship. They are not a hiatus from the Christian life. During these years you will and should have somewhat different priorities from those you will have later on. But even as a seminarian, you have a responsibility to do things other than study. You are a Christian first, a student second.”

Having just finished seminary a year and a half ago, I can testify it was “the best of times and worst of times,” but God used seminary to refine me and build a firm theological foundation that could withstand the storms of life and ministry. Press on, and God bless you brother!

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